Topic: My Thoughts & Suggestions & Bug Reports

[bluebyte]

Hi,
First of all, I greet The Chaos Empire Community.
I am a long-time D2 player and fan, and for some time I was trying the MODs, so far I have tried 5-6 MODs and I can't say that I am totally satisfied with any of them.
CE 7.66 SP3, which is my latest discovery, is the best of them. This mod is great, and I am almost sure that I will play CE all the time from now on. Some mods change the game entirely (total conversion) so much that it becomes like an another game, which I don't like. CE keeps the original content the same, but adds new things. This is very nice. I am considering making a donation in a few days, to show you my appreciation.
I don't play multi, only SinglePlayer.
I will try to make constructive feedback about the mod, and will post any bugs that may I may find. Right now I have a few thoughts and one little bug, but in the future I will update this thread with new messages for future bug findings, feedback etc...
With that said, I also should mention that I find this mod relatively stable (compared to others).

So, here we go, this small bug first:


- I think the new appearance of Wraith monsters are a bit dull. I prefer the old appearance, or a more enriched/beautiful would be better IMHO.
- Also the quest completion sound effect, I think the original was better. And the same for town portal effect. I personally think that they are a bit out of place. But maybe this is just because I am used to the original ones. Oh well, at least no Homer Simpson 'Doh' effect when opening a trapped chest, as in Zy-El

I will keep posting others in the future.
Congratualtions on this MOD, keep up the good work!
Greetings from Turkey

[Fenris]

where do you see a bug there? the scrolls are from a very,very old version, they contained informations about items and monster(some of them are still usefull)
sometime the were deactivated, at the moment you can cube 10scrolls to get a random rune

the graphics are like they are, some people like them, some not, can you give everybody what he wants?

btw you know that you can make up to seven 7 golems in ce? every 20 points you skill you get one

[bluebyte]

Dummy Text73 seemed like a left-over string in .txt files, so I guess this is the actual name of the scroll?
About golems: yes, I read somewhere that you can have multiple golems at once in CE

[Fenris]

hmm nobody seemed to have a problem with this dummy texts, so i think chaos wanted that they are like they are

[bluebyte]

Just finished act2
When fighting Duriel, merc didn't attack. He ignored Duriel. I tried teleing / changing position but to no avail.

[Fenris]

hmm i didn´t ever hear of this bug, but it must be an d2 intern, and chaos won´t be able to fix it i think

[webwalker]

As a thought here, the Skelliemancer is a BUSTED BUILD.  It's my favorite, so this provokes serious whining, which I usually keep to myself.

In Hell/CGS, monster mobs are thick enough that having 2 (or more) aura-enhanced bosses within 2 screens of one another is not uncommon, and the aura is high enough in level that if anybody has an aura, everybody within 2 screens has it too.  Therefore you run into multiple-aura mobs.

If one of those auras is Concentration, then the damage they deal is very large. 
    Result1: (this affects everybody) Monsters can (often enough) do 4000 dmage in one hit.
    Result 2: (this renders the skelliemancer impotent in Hell/CGS) lvl 52/53 raise skeleton/skeleton mastery minions get shredded like tissue paper.

Work-around: build a poison/bone or poison/golem mancer, maybe (just maybe) use skellies as an assist/backup.

So far, attempts to converse about this with the Mod Team have not gone well.  It's been this way for about a year, and looks to be permanent.

[ChaosEmpire]

nothing is permanent...but with a higher level they dont die..
level 50..is something for mid LR...

[bluebyte]

I also thought about this, and suspected that they will get overwhelmed in hell. I planned this build like this:
Max skel mastery
Max skel warrior
10-15 Revive
Amp damage, Decrepify for more aggressive enemies, Attract(crowd control) as primary curses.

This was the initial proposal. But I soon realized I will face many unbreakable PIs, so also
Max skel mage
Put points in Lower resist.

And for left over points, either a fire or iron golem.

Also Very important: Oak Sage for the survuvability of my army.

I intend this build to be a physical summoner.
I will make a faith crossbow for my necro and use it (will actually fire with it, putting points into Dex., so hoping contribute to the killing speed)
Might merc(do they exist in CE? If not, some other way to get might)
Concentration(Pride runeword or some other new CE item giving this aura)
At the moment, I would be glad for item recommendations to get those three auras.

So I hope that this will make for good physical damage. But I think PIs will cause some headache to me. I consider getting freezing arrow oskill or explodiong arrow or something for my necro (recommendations?). Another possibility is to get an act3 merc for elemental damage.

Edit: Also noticed that Corpse explosion was severely nerfed. Can someone give me an idea what radius does it have at which skill level?
***

I noticed in some areas I cannot teleport, but in some areas I can. For example, no teleport in Plains of Despair, but I can teleport in City of the Damned.
I understand that for Durance Level 3, but can't see the logic for others? Especially two similar areas, but one has teleport the other doesn't. Is this a bug?

[webwalker]

If you're going with a Faith bow in the end-game, grab a "Ranger's Sting" unique short war bow (level 30) and strafe like mad until you're able to equip the Faith bow.  Alternate: "Beeswarm" unique long battle bow for Multi-shot for the same period.

I find skel mages to be detrimental: they block stairs and doorways until they die or until their target dies or move away.  That can be very slow if a poison-mage is firing is little green blobs at a poison immune monster.
Look into Poison Nova.

If you temper the faith-bow for elemental damage, you can help with the physical immunes there.  Note that throwing spears (Harpoons) can receive the Faith runeword, allowing you to carry a shield while throwing.

Might mercs exist, Act II (hire in NM and keep him).  Alternate is the Act 5 merc (Hire in NM, he has Conviction which will make hitting targets easier)

Corpse Explosion has been nerfed into uselessness.  If you're playing Single Player, create a new link to the game executable with a command line like ["C:\path\to\Diablo II\game.exe" -act5] (keep spaces, omit square brackets), then when you create a character he'll be level 95.  Spend the skill points how you want to, and see how the synergies and radius add up.

Mod feature: Anti-Rushing involves disabling Teleport in some places.  This is a severe pain in those places, because the Teleport Spell (a.k.a. Summon Minion) is vital.

About "Level 5x is OK for mid LR/NM": I got plusses to RS/Summoning/necro/all: 3 from hat, 4 from shield, 5 from wand (actually HotO), 4 from anni, 2 from belt, 5 from rings & ammy, 1 from skiller: 24 + 30 is 54.  That's about as many plusses as I can count on always being able to get.  So I guess Chaos has agreed that the Skellimancer has been busted in CGS, or has been made extremely dependent on gear that I don't think we can get in NM/LR.  The Hardcore Ladder has some high level necro's on it, I suspect they're all poison/bone/golem mancers. No Skelemancer Guide for 7.65 exists.

[Fenris]

yeah you can get an might merc, use the boots called lysianns eyecatcher for concentration
and an infinity or doom weapon(slow or lower resis/def)

use fire golem, its much better

btw why only oak sage and not bo?

i´m not sure if there is a way ot get one of this bow skills, but you can get guided arrow+ venom for teddy

it isn´t a bug, it´s antirush feature that you can´t teleport in many areas


edit:

brian was faster-.-

btw

then when you create a character he'll be level 95

it´s level 96

I find skel mages to be detrimental: they block stairs and doorways until they die or until their target dies or move away.  That can be very slow if a poison-mage is firing is little green blobs at a poison immune monster.
Look into Poison Nova.

fire golem may be an option, too

[bluebyte]

Oh man. This was disappointing :/
Faith in javelin seems attractive though. Even can make me start a new char for it.
What about baba wielding two of them? Will fana aura stack (i.e lvl 24-30)?

[Fenris]

yes it will stack

[bluebyte]

Here are some fresh ideas from me;
- Poisonable Concrete traps : Looks silly, and senseless in my opinion. They should be immune to poison i think.
- Mercenaries
In this mod every mercenary can use every type(well, most of) of weapons. For example, a barbarian merc can use a dagger. But I think that he shouldn't be able to use a dagger as good as a sword. Because obliously they have characteristics and specialities.

What I suggest is, to give them implicit bonuses to their specific type of weapons. For example, implicit passive Sword Mastery skill for barbarian, and bow mastery for rogue, etc...
Or vice versa, penalties for any other weapon than the specific weapon.

In this way, our example barbarian merc can continue to use other weapons, but he is far superior with the sword than any other weapon...

- Also about mercenaries; I can equip a merc with a quiver of arrows(and only a quiver of arrows). This also doesn't make sense.

So that's it for now. I think those changes are needed. The first and the last are not that important but I think that the second one is.
BUT, I can understand you have other reasons behind those decisions, or maybe those are not possible.
For example, the skill slots for mercenaries may be full or something like that, and those mastery skills can't be added. I am not sure.
Postet at: June 19, 2006, 05:23:37 pm

btw you know that you can make up to seven 7 golems in ce? every 20 points you skill you get one

Can you make this a bit clearer please? I now have lvl 14 clay and 4 blood golem but one destroys the other. If I understand you right, a golem which is more than lvl 20 won't be killed by another summoned.

[Fenris]

first no everything is logic^^

second  first i thought you want that mercs only use the weapon u see on them, but then: "hey good idea!"

third hey u can use an arrow to kill somebody if it is poissened adn you don´t even need a bow to do it, do you?

hmm no only the points you skilled work(like synergies), +skills don´t work

[webwalker]

To equip a merc with arrows and no bow is not less logical than to equip them with a bow and no arrows.  Either way, the barb will use it like a big sword.  Barbs are just that way!

You can equip a rogue with a huge axe, and she'll fire arrows with it (not everything is logical).

and, arrows *can* be inserted manually.

@bluebyte: I don't know what you mean by "concrete traps".

Giving a point in Mastery for their "normal" weapon types (bow, pole-arm, and sword) would make mercs (other than ActIII) stronger with those weapon types.  Appealing idea (to me).

Me: Looking forward to the day when Skeletal Warriors can (again) hold their own. *sigh*.

[bluebyte]

@bluebyte: I don't know what you mean by "concrete traps".

Hey,
I mean those fortified traps like fire towers in act2 deserts, or for example gargoyle traps in act1 catacombs.
Still, no big deal.
The same for the arrow thing.

I wonder CE's response for merc weapon masteries idea. I knew that you guys would find it logical as me.

Abandoned my skelly necro

Now making another. The plan is this:

Max teeth, bone spirit, bone spear

Max golem mastery
Max Clay, Blood, Fire golem
5-6 in summon resist.
Comments welcome as always

Right now totally dominating PoC with bone spear. Fun to play.

Another remark: Those acid beasts do some insane damage. Almost killed me several times despite I try to escape their deadly "acid carpet"

But the golem and merc is too stupid to avoid it
What's the type of this damage? Physical or Poison?

[ChaosEmpire]

the code for mercs is first version...
later version of this code implemented a configurable useable merc equip..but..this was not realm compatible..so i decided to leave realm fiunction..and loose the bow only merc and so on...

[webwalker]

Hey,
I mean those fortified traps like fire towers in act2 deserts, or for example gargoyle traps in act1 catacombs.

Gotchya.  You aren't poisoning the stone, but the demonic/undead spirit that changed the stone into an attacking thing. (my take on it)

The same for the arrow thing.

Arrow?

Abandoned my skelly necro

That was my favorite build, sturdy and dependable.  Now, he needs to stay in "crisis management mode" at all times in Hell/CGS. No fun.
This is Chaos' Mod, and we're in all effect playing in a LAN party at his house, so the skelliemancer is his to strengthen or cripple as he pleases.
I'm frustrated at the loss of my favorite build, and at his saying that the build works just fine.
*shrug*

The plan is this:
Max teeth, bone spirit, bone spear
Max golem mastery
Max Clay, Blood, Fire golem
5-6 in summon resist.
Comments welcome as always

Ah!  The BoGoMancer (Bone Golem).  Since bone spirit/spear deal physical and magical damage, and the fire golem deals (d'oh) fire damage, you need your merc to deal out one (or more) of the other three attack forms: cold, poison, or lightning.

1 point in summon resist, with the +20 to skills you'll have later on, will give +71 resists to all summons.  Adding another point increases this to +71, in other words it's wasted points.
1 point in Lower Resists is useful, but I get mine from the doll stash and put extra points in Poison Nova.

Another remark: Those acid beasts do some insane damage. Almost killed me several times despite I try to escape their deadly "acid carpet"
But the golem and merc is too stupid to avoid it
What's the type of this damage? Physical or Poison?

Acid-Beast barf-damage is Magic, just like the magic damage they're immune to.
And yes, the merc and the golem have a long-running contest to see which can out-stoopid the other.
Prize goes to the ... damn, I can't tell!

[bluebyte]

CE, there are many small item title errors (especially on set items other than Talonrage's)
Would you fix them if I(or maybe we) make a complete list of it?
Most of the problem comes from the confusing of the plural-singular meaning " s " and the belonging " 's "
For example " Blood Ravens Legacy " and many others...
Also I encountered some misspelled unique titles. The list will be updated as more misspelled names are discovered.
Sure, they don't mess the game but I think the mod will look more polished, professional that way

[ChaosEmpire]

surely we can do this
for the english version...
all other languages also have english content...but..if i also fix it there..i need to make same corrcture in ~7languages...

but...probably i find someone doing this time consuming job

for the skellimancer...
i expect skel mage+skell as working build, but more a summoner should work...but needs many points...

[webwalker]

i expect skel mage+skell as working build, but more a summoner should work...but needs many points...

I've posted many times that the Skel Mage is a detriment, not an asset.  He blocks doorways etc. I put 1 point there to get to Revive.  If it wasn't a pre-req, I wouldn't skill Skel Mages.  The AI is too crippled and the damage is not significant in Hell.

However: if points in Skel Mages gave elemental damage to Skel Warriors (as in a Vengeance synergy) then points would go into Skel Mages.
Likewise: If Skel Mages were built around the Ghost (flies and goes through other monsters and other monsters, eg my minions, just step through them) then Skel Mages would not be a detriment.  They wouldn't block doorways.  Their brainless AI (poison mages throwing green blobs at poison immune monsters) would get in anythings way.  They don't even need to fly... just be transparent to other monsters & minions.

Revive, as always, has the problem of its AI: sticking to walls and vanishing.

Notwithstanding the weakness of the Skel Mage and the Revive, the Skel Warrior was formerly sufficiently sturdy that the summoner necro could handle Hell gracefully.  Since about last year this time, the summoner necro has been crippled; viable necros have been first a bone, golem, or poison necro with skeletons as an assist.

[ChaosEmpire]

brian
there is nothing, other than in original..and the AI has been ever so bad..it is hardcoded..and i dont understand why it is playable in d2..but not ce for you...

[webwalker]

and i dont understand why it (skellimancer) is playable in d2.. but not ce for you...

from http://chaosempire.info/web/content/view/14/37/

Version 7.58 (Patch based on 7.55):
...
Raise Skelleton now every 5th SkillPoint gives a Seklleton, HP decreased

This was the death of the Skellimancer.  Before then I played the skellimancer and enjoyed them greatly.  Since this time the skellimancer has been unplayable in Hell. 

Poison, Bone, and Golem-mancers have been playable, and having skeleton warriors as a back-up to the poison/bone/golem skills has been optional. What is dead is the skeleton as the backbone, with poison, bone, and golem skills as a backup.  This Skellimancer build has been dead for a little over a year, since 7.58/7.60d. 

We discussed this http://chaosempire.info/web/component/option,com_smf/Itemid,61/topic,8285.0 here, although since mostly it was in German with strange character representation (e.g. können) it was undecipherable to me. 

We also discussed it Re: Nec´s in HC Hell (wieder) kastr...äh beschnitten oder (noch) spielbar ? here.  The last description I could find of a "killer skelliemancer" claimed it was easy with 70 +skills.  I have found +40skills quite the accomplishment.

Your favorite classes, as I recall, are barb and assassin.  Mine's the skellimancer.  The skellimancer is, at this time, a busted build due to the nerf'd skeletal warrior.

the AI has been ever so bad..it is hardcoded

I understood that from the beginning.  I wasn't complaining against anything in the mod to do with the AI there, rather, I pointed out why those skills don't compensate for a crippled skeletal warrior.

Is it a possibility, to give the skeleton warrior elemental damage, from a (new) "vengeance" synergy based on points put into skeletal mages?

Is it a possiblity, to make the skeletal mage out of the old "ghost", so that they don't block doors and walkways?

Is it possible, to make the skeleton immune to B.O. and give the skeleton back his life?

[ChaosEmpire]

you have forgotten one thing..life has been increased 2-3times since 758...

for ele dmg on base skells i need to check..but this is one reason for the mages...

the mages have same ai i think..so all should block..but i need to look into files

[webwalker]

life has been increased 2-3times since 758...

I must have missed the announcements.  However, skeletons in CGS get shredded like tissue paper so either
1: the skeleton life is still significantly less than before 7.58, or
2: the increased damage done by concentration-enhanced monsters over-powered the restored life,
either way the skeleton is waaaay to fragile in CGS/Hell.

for ele dmg on base skells i need to check..but this is one reason for the mages...
the mages have same ai i think..so all should block..but i need to look into files

Skeleton warriors close to engage, so other warriors behind them can approach and engage (until the target is crowded)
Skeleton mages stop where they decide to engage a target and just shoot and shoot and shoot, leaving all skeleton warriors behind them blocked.

Suggestion: build a level 96 skelemancer and drive him around a little.  Blood a hat & shield & belt, CoH some armor, grab a HotO and jewelry, so that you have level 55 raise skeleton and skeletal mastery, and see how long things hold up against Conc mobs in the catecombs in Hell.

[ChaosEmpire]

once again level 55 skills is something for LR, for cgs you will need higher skills
the skill tree is able to reach lvl100...so try to get same level as good as possible...

use a good skilled barb in party with shout battle order/command
more life, more skills...

i will test with a char with skill lvl 70 and higher...

[Fenris]

hmm what equip do you use, brian?

as i count

30 points stated
helm(+2nec or +3 summon +2from blood) +4-5
armor(coh) +2
hoto +5
jewellry +6 or more(diva is 7, should be possible to get)
belt(blood) +2
schild(+2 nec,blood) +4
some skillers(up to one is possible for everyone) +1-x
anni +5
gloves 0-2 (only uebers got more skills)
boots +0-1(only uebers got more skills)
=59-64(or more if you one more skillers)

this is a possible equip for everyone

so chaos you should try it with that skilllvl(hmm in hc it´s maybe less? i don´t know if you equip your chars there different?)

[webwalker]

I had 55 RS/SM, because I had resists-boosting armor in place of CoH.

Hat and Shield were +1 (plus Blood) rather than +2 because Gheed was stingy.  Belt was resists + Blood.

For my other gear, we'd have to ask the back-up tapes, because Bonebrain is dead and refuses to share information.

He did have 95 resist all in Hell...

If 55 is "only for NM/LR", and Chaos is going to prove his point by testing with 70+ skills (total)
then we're saying that 70 skills is the minimum for entering Hell.  I think Chaos proving things with 70 sklills proves nothing since I can't get 70 skills in NM/LR.

How does one get +40 to skills without gifts from others in NM/LR and Normal./PoC?  Think Ironman build.
Think Single Play, on realm or at home.

Please somebody translate my request for a SkellieMancer guide into German, and plead with the ubermeistertotbeschwaren to record their "Animated Corpse Managment for Dummies" and translate it to English.  I'd really lie to know how it's done.

[ChaosEmpire]

some builds have always been very skill dependend, and for those you need mostly another char who collects skill items..or many time

also HC is surely much harder, and this means that special build COULD be less possible

also mostly all builds depend on a 2dmg build...like fire/ice sorc...magic/physical and so on

with a skelliemancer you only have physical...without the mages...
there must be way, to get him woring in hell..with many skillspoints...to block ladder rushes with skellimancer...so it must be slow...but safely...like ever...
to get this well balanced..surely some more fine tuning could be possible...

but i expect this build more of a combination out of all summons, instead of skells only