Topic: Suggestions - new since 7.49 and some old

[jbtilley]

1)  I still don't understand the big deal about not retaining the map for _single player_ games.  I understand the reasons for multiplayer/LAN games.
2)  Why no abillity to buy tp or idenify scrolls from the beginning?  As it satnds I end up with a lot of stuff I can't identify until I rescue cain.  The workaround is simple...get a bunch of identity/tp tomes in the shared stash area for newly created characters to access.  Since I'm sure everyone is doing that why not just make them available from the beginning?
3)  The stash is in town on act I now   Now it is gone from act II (I haven't gotten as far as acts iii-v to see if they are there yet).  Why not put it back in act 2?  It is a bit inconvininet to travel back to act I (or sewers 2 for that matter) just to access the stash.
4)  The butcher was loose in act I!  I'd need at least a lvl 40 character to survive getting past him.  The only way I was able to do it was to have two players.  One lures him far away while the other goes the opposite direction and makes a portal for the "bait" to come back through.  Must have died 5 times in that section.  Please make butcher optional again.

[DrowElf]

Answers:

1) This is needed to make some enemies change places from game to game (DC, Leo and Andariel etc).

2) Why don´t you put all unidentified items to the stash. If you need more identify and townportal you can mule them from new chars to the stash

3) The only stash in town is the stash in act1, like before it was in act2

4) This is the wanted effect from the butcher. Have you ever played Diablo? There you have even more chances to die at the butcher when you first meet him. Let the room closed and nothing happen to you if you are too weak to beat him.

[jbtilley]

4)  Yes.  I have played Diablo.  I remember that he was tough but managable if you leveled a bit.  I seem to remember that you could meet him at an early level but if you were patient and leveled even just 3 or so levels more then you could easily take him.

That is the problem.  I know about the room he hides in.  I have always avoided it like the plague (when I was playing 7.49).  Now he is automatically out in the open in that room just before the large one that used to have the smaller room that contained him.  That sounded confusing - at any rate he was in the room near the large fountain - not in the normal isolated room - in a main passage.

There is no way to get past that small room because butcher is already in it.  I hate to think how long you would have to play act I to lvl enough to beat butcher before you can get to andariel.

[DrowElf]

That the Butcher leaves his room, hasn´t happend to me at this time.

I think that it is not normal that he does this. Have you skelettons? They open in most cases closed doors. That is the reason i leave this big room as fast as i can normally.

[jbtilley]

No we didn't have any summonables.  Just a level 17 sorc and lvl 17 assasin.  Butcher was loose in the room before the large room, so there was no chance that someone accidentally opened the door.

Maybe it is an isolated incident.  I remember when I heard "Fresh Meat" when we were well before the usual butcher jail cell and thinking.  CRAP - they changed it.  Why would they change it! there is no way to get past this.

I'll have to go back when I level some more to see if it was an isolated incident.

[bdpf]

YOU BETTER BELEAVE

Your merc can trigger open the door of butchers
cell

a merc (rouge) can be a little devil this way

bdpf[/size][/size]

[Fenris]

loosed  some of my hc chars by a 1-hit-kill from butcher-.-

but never in katakombs lvl 4 cause even if the door is open hid didn´t came out if nobody attacked or attract him out

in jail lvl 1 (maybe in an other but i think it is lvl 1) he can be too and there he isn´t in a separate room(i looks like a normal room from outsight, and there´s not much place in there) maybe you mean this?

[jbtilley]

No he was definitely in lvl 4 before you get to andariel.  There was no chance a merc opened the door.  Unless they wandered at least 3-4 screens farther than we went - past 50 tainteds, opened the door, and walked back - past 100s of tainteds..

[Olfmo]

it happens sometimes that the butcher isn't placed right in the catacombs so when you open the doors to the big room which contains the small butcher's room he already stands in front of you... that's how my sorc died once with lvl 97 2 ladders ago just as i said my sorc survives the butcher but i wasn't prepared

[satye]

Say jbtilley, Why are you complaining? You are playing CHAOS EMPIRE !! The name speaks for itself. That is the point, the challenge, to conquer what ever is placed before you. With skill, cunning or down right Power. Do you think, in all honesty, that running the same ole thing over and over is supposed to be the way this game is played. Your wrong. This game is made for True players, You have to Think and figure it out!! That is the enjoyment and why so many people love it. The obstacles can be conquered. If you apply yourself you will win!!

[jbtilley]

Ha ha.  You take the butcher on with a lvl 15-16 sorc.  I guess I could have spent a month leveling to 30 to still get it handed to me - but I'd rather use that time to advance in the game.

[webwalker]

Say jbtilley, Why are you complaining? You are playing CHAOS EMPIRE !! The name speaks for itself. That is the point, the challenge, to conquer what ever is placed before you. With skill, cunning or down right Power. This game is made for True players, You have to Think and figure it out!! That is the enjoyment and why so many people love it. The obstacles can be conquered. If you apply yourself you will win!!

LOL! @sa-tye, you're hysterical.  In soft core, and wired on drugs, and bored to tears, I *might* agree to apply this logic to The Butcher being in Cat 4 and loose without deliberate player action to confront him. 

In HardCore, a one-hit-kill, like The Butcher is, that is not avoidable (e.g. when The Butcher lets himself out of his room) is a bug in the game design or implementation.

I have seen the Butcher's door, in Cat 4, MANY times, open without my having gone near it (I peek from as far away as I can).  If the Butcher spawns near enough to the door to "see" it and use it to close with me, this is a one-hit-kill for ANY character that is at the proper level for questing in Cat 4 Normal.

(sometimes Monsters will open doors... I've been in Cat4 several times where I open one door between two rooms, and the mosnters will open the other door.  This is going into the room that has the Butcher's Chamber in it.)

The Butcher should be in the Crypt beneath Tristram, along with Leo.  Or with The Seven.

(Leo's capital in Diablo I was Triistram, no?  Where was the Butcher's hang-out in Diablo I?)

Idea: when The Butcher leaves his room let the message appear in words, pop-up, and sound: "The Butcher has declared hostility towards you"...

....just to let us know...

[ChaosEmpire]

The Butcher is on a tile, as far as possible from the door.
also he has the not move flag, so the game wont place him randomly in a range around the designed point

i never will believe that the butcher will be placed outside of the room without opening the door...and yes, i saw mercs and mosnters opening the doors...but the door is on the other side..so normaly you can go on left side and leave butcher a good old man...and visit him little bit later..or with lvl18 psy assa

[agnostic]

no chaos...one time I was lvling my assassin at the catacombs (without merc/summons/other players) i opened the door to the big room and he stood there, waiting for me...
he WAS there without any opened doors etc...

[Olfmo]

i have to agree here... the butcher definitely was outside his jail some times even if nobody was there before... we just entered the big room and he stood there waiting for us

[ChaosEmpire]

i can only say, what has been coded...if the map and the values dont do what i entered..thanks blizzard for making a non random entry sometims random..

[webwalker]

@chaos: Go to Butcher's chamber in cat4 and stand next to the wall he's "placed" near, and see if you hear him "wake up" ("Ahhhhhhh FRESH MEAT").
Thunder out a few war-cries, cast a few curses, plant a hydra, cast a blizzard, cloak some shadows etc.  All from the OTHER SIDE of the wall from The Butcher.  See if it "wakes him up".

I've heard Leoric wake up plenty of times while I'm on the other side of the wall from him.  I see the light-pulse of his Bone Spirit smacking the wall on his side, so I know he (and his spell) see me through the wall.

I stay too far away from The Butcher to do this "wake up" test (Operation Coffee).

However, since Curse spell Area Of Effect penetrates walls, as does Corpse Explosion, and possibly Rogue Sanctuary/InnerSight/SlowMissiles etc, there's possibly a large number of things that will wake him up besides knocking on his door.

If possible: have his "wake up" trigger his "hostility" so we know to run^H^H^Hteleport^H^H^H^H^H^H^Hsave/exit.

[GothicTomCat]

I play a druid and I play strategy when it comes to the butcher.  Normally summons won't go beyond a screen from you, so I usually stay along the outer walls were the goodies are and have no problem.  Then come back after I finish act 3 to finish him off.